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Yes, I went to a Tea Party today. It was pretty kickass. However, I realize that since most of my f-list doesn't share my fiscal conservative leanings, so this might not be the post for you, although you are all certainly welcome to post and disagree with me.
I just want to state before I show the pictures that:
1. I blame the Republicans just as much the Democrats for the out of control spending that's going on in Washington right now. George Bush along with congressional Republicans started this bullshit with their bailouts and overblown spending budgets and their reckless Federal Reserve policies. The Democrats (like Barney Frank - who ignored all of the warning signs at Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac) and Barack Obama seem hell bent on making the problem worse. I blame them all equally. I was so pissed at the first bailout done by GW that not only did I call all of my Representatives and bitch, I voted against my Democrat Senator and Republican representative in the 2008 election.
2. I'm not a Republican. I'm not a Democrat. I'm an independent who thinks that both MSNBC and FOX news are full of overblown talking head asshats, and gets her news primarily from NPR and the Wall Street Journal. Right now I'm pretty equally angry at MSNBC for marginalizing a legitimate protest as a handful of racist right winger loons, as I am at Fox news for trying to co-opt and cash in on these protest that have jack all to do with them.
3. I went to law school right across from the capitol building, and in the course of three years, I'd seen a lot of protests, but never one this large or active before. There had to be at least 5,000 people there (MSNBC claims 7000 - I think that's probably a bit high).
Anyway fun protest picture time. And what would a protest be without a giant pig? Actually, it makes for a great place to meet up with people in that big of a crowd, because seriously, you cannot miss the giant freaking pig. I kind of wonder where the giant pig gets stored. Like maybe just sits in someone's driveway, being all large and pink and obnoxious and driving the neighbors crazy.
Some questionable fashion choices. A part of me thinks it takes a lot of confidence to show up in public in a tricorn hat and coat. A part of me is sad that he didn't come entirely in costume with pants and a wig to match.
Definitely the scariest thing I saw all day - old people in mohawks, which apparently was a theme. I have no idea what the hell that was about, but the crowd was too loud to ask.
Some people angry with our Governor (there was a lot of that actually). Given how messed up Michigan has gotten during her eight years in office, I really don't blame them.
Another sign directed specifically at our Governor.
Some people angry with the Federal Reserve giving out cheap money and devaluing the dollar. There were a ton of people protesting this (including myself).
Bailout frustration.
People angry with the president and congress.
People angry about the debt that's going to be passed to the next generation.
Heh.
And my favorite sign of the day - one that I think sums up how I and a lot of other people felt:
I just want to state before I show the pictures that:
1. I blame the Republicans just as much the Democrats for the out of control spending that's going on in Washington right now. George Bush along with congressional Republicans started this bullshit with their bailouts and overblown spending budgets and their reckless Federal Reserve policies. The Democrats (like Barney Frank - who ignored all of the warning signs at Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac) and Barack Obama seem hell bent on making the problem worse. I blame them all equally. I was so pissed at the first bailout done by GW that not only did I call all of my Representatives and bitch, I voted against my Democrat Senator and Republican representative in the 2008 election.
2. I'm not a Republican. I'm not a Democrat. I'm an independent who thinks that both MSNBC and FOX news are full of overblown talking head asshats, and gets her news primarily from NPR and the Wall Street Journal. Right now I'm pretty equally angry at MSNBC for marginalizing a legitimate protest as a handful of racist right winger loons, as I am at Fox news for trying to co-opt and cash in on these protest that have jack all to do with them.
3. I went to law school right across from the capitol building, and in the course of three years, I'd seen a lot of protests, but never one this large or active before. There had to be at least 5,000 people there (MSNBC claims 7000 - I think that's probably a bit high).
Anyway fun protest picture time. And what would a protest be without a giant pig? Actually, it makes for a great place to meet up with people in that big of a crowd, because seriously, you cannot miss the giant freaking pig. I kind of wonder where the giant pig gets stored. Like maybe just sits in someone's driveway, being all large and pink and obnoxious and driving the neighbors crazy.
Some questionable fashion choices. A part of me thinks it takes a lot of confidence to show up in public in a tricorn hat and coat. A part of me is sad that he didn't come entirely in costume with pants and a wig to match.
Definitely the scariest thing I saw all day - old people in mohawks, which apparently was a theme. I have no idea what the hell that was about, but the crowd was too loud to ask.
Some people angry with our Governor (there was a lot of that actually). Given how messed up Michigan has gotten during her eight years in office, I really don't blame them.
Another sign directed specifically at our Governor.
Some people angry with the Federal Reserve giving out cheap money and devaluing the dollar. There were a ton of people protesting this (including myself).
Bailout frustration.
People angry with the president and congress.
People angry about the debt that's going to be passed to the next generation.
Heh.
And my favorite sign of the day - one that I think sums up how I and a lot of other people felt:
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Bah!
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If you do a web search on my name this (http://www.commondreams.org/headlines03/0221-02.htm) is still near the top of the list and its the one closest to the top that actually has anything to do with me rather than some namesake.
A bit embarrassing really. But then, my views on the war have evolved since then (not that I don't still think it was a mistake).
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And I want you to know that while I might not agree with all of them, I respect your views entirely.
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Anyway, i think the folks wearing mohawks is a "shout out" to the native americans, considering that the original Boston Tea Party protesters dressed up like native americans. The irony. Honestly, I believe Obama is/was "trying" but I think he knows we are seriously 'fucked up'. Doing something about it or nothing at all won't pull our asses out the fire. One of those "damn if you do and damn if you don't"
I would LOVE to set fire to FOX! We are in a serious mess right now,and blaming which party for who ain't helping.
I can only find some good news in this "my state of alabama" money being tight as it is, has slowed the number of excutions on death row. Instead of the 5 our beloved crooked attorney state general Troy King wanted, he had to make the decision to whittle the number down to three this year. He's under federal investgation for misconduct-going all the way back to beginning years as a fresh face lawyer! The feds may have to review ALL Troy King's cases.
The good thing about all this mess, is what was done in the dark is coming to light, and anyone that got their hand caught in the cookie jar can't weasle thier way out. No smooth talking is going to set them free.
I am pissed that the banks are getting bailed out with my little $$/per hour check! I say let the banks go down. Hell, the banks repo your shit when you can't pay, but now that THEY can't pay the banks want us to pay?
I suppose that rich fat cats money can be used as toliet paper, because with the way things are going it'll be worth that much.
I should cash in my Monopoly property now-LOL! I still own Park Place and Broadway! Passing Go would be my one time stimtlus check. LOL
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Oh geeze, you're totally right. *facepalm* For some reason I got why people were wearing feather headdresses, but when I see old white people with dyed mohawks I think of British Punk bands (which was why it was so confusing, lol).
The irony. Honestly, I believe Obama is/was "trying" but I think he knows we are seriously 'fucked up'.
I don't envy him. I really don't. While I don't agree with everything he does, it seems like he's taking shit from all sides (both left and right). Being the President has to be the shittiest job ever.
I can only find some good news in this "my state of alabama" money being tight as it is, has slowed the number of excutions on death row.
That's really good news. While I'm not opposed necessarily to the death penalty in theory (I think there are very rare cases in which it's appropriate), in practice, with all of the problems in our criminal justice system it's a really bad idea. I think it's crazy to continue executions without addressing some very serious issues like ineffective assistance of state appointed defense council for people who are too poor to afford their own attorney (which I could write a whole rant about), to problems with evidence and witnesses, as well the enormous amount of money that it costs the state every time it executes someone.
I am pissed that the banks are getting bailed out with my little $$/per hour check! I say let the banks go down. Hell, the banks repo your shit when you can't pay, but now that THEY can't pay the banks want us to pay?
Exactly. You shouldn't. It's total bullshit that they get to keep the money if they make a profit, but you have to cover their losses due to stupid business decisions. And when I see banks like Citibank, a freaking credit card company getting bailout money, that really makes me angry.
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Do I like the deficit spending? Hell, no. I've refused to send any petitions to my state government to save programs, even programs that I wish would not get cut. However, I am tired of people not grasping the concept that stuff like fire departments, schools, roads, libraries, unemployment, and other benefits of civilization do not come cheap. America also gets off light compared to Canada, Japan, and most of Europe. We are losing ground against other countries in terms of economic viability part due to the neglect of our infrastructure, educational system, and health care. We're going to need to fix them if we have a hope in hell for the long term.
I'm also furious over the fact that 2/3 of corporations pay NO taxes, and that those who can pay CPAs to cook the books a bit can weasel out of their share or create some tax haven out of a Bahamas mail drop while the (honest folk/proletariat/working class/rest of us) have to make up for their share. I also hate that most of my tax dollars get flushed on a debt that was primarily made up of no-bid "defense" contracts, war and energy profiteering (among other creative ways to kill people), and rewarding the bastards who outsource to sweatshops. I'd rather my share of the civilization bill go for education, diplomacy, and making sure our bridges don't collapse.
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I really don't know much about Reagan's spending, because I was in grade school at the time. He did bail out the Savings and Loan banks, which I don't agree with. On the other hand, I don't think even he spent the kind of money that Washington has tossed around in the last six months. The amounts now are utterly staggering in their enormity, and when we look at the Congressional Budget Office's projections, well it get's downright frightening.
But you're right that wasteful spending is wasteful spending, and that the Republicans are just as guilty as the Democrats. Unfortunately, I'm afraid that it's the nature of a big government, no matter who is in charge, to waste taxpayer money. That's why I think limited government is a good thing, albeit probably something that will never happen now.
Certainly Bill Clinton deserves credit for the budget surplus as well as the congressional Republicans that controlled congress at the time. Actually, since this protest took place in Michigan (the last time this state went red was Reagan's second term), it's quite probable that a lot of these people voted for Bill Clinton - especially the union guys that came.
However, I am tired of people not grasping the concept that stuff like fire departments, schools, roads, libraries, unemployment, and other benefits of civilization do not come cheap.
I don't think anyone there was angry that they pay taxes to support any of that stuff, at least I know I wasn't. Judging from their signs, they were far more focused on the out of control deficit spending over the stimulus package and government bailouts of the banks.
True, some of the stimulus money is going to be used for that stuff, but I'm not convinced that throwing a shit ton of money at problems like education, healthcare, etc... is the answer. Personally, I think there are far cheaper policy decisions that could be made to help those areas that wouldn't cost us much at all. And to borrow over a trillion dollars to just dump into the economy - when we're eventually going to have to pay interest on that money - I just think that's madness.
But I do get what you're saying - that people want all of the government goodies, but don't want to pay for them, and to some extent I agree with that. I just don't think it really applies to what this protest was about.
I'm also furious over the fact that 2/3 of corporations pay NO taxes, and that those who can pay CPAs to cook the books a bit can weasel out of their share or create some tax haven out of a Bahamas mail drop while the (honest folk/proletariat/working class/rest of us) have to make up for their share.
I don't know about the numbers over how much most corporations pay in taxes. I can say, with bitter experience, that I've seen what Michigan's high corporate tax rate has done to our business community - namely that it's driven a ton of businesses out of the state and in some cases, to foreign countries. In a global economy, where it's far easier for businesses to simply leave if they don't like the tax rates, I'm afraid that higher corporate taxes will only make things worse.
Don't get me wrong though. Even though I have a somewhat libertarian bent, I'm not a big fan of corporate America (my husband has been laid off four times in the last eight years - so I definitely hear what you're saying).
And thanks for your thoughtful comment. It's always interesting to hear what people with different points of view have to say.
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I'll echo what Allronix said--I'm totally okay with having my taxes go to support infrastructure and social programs. I like civilization. If you want to know where these people were when deficit spending came from the last administration, the organizers--the folks behind it all--were enjoying the benefits. These tea parties were an astroturf thing--all funded and promo'd by some pretty big corporate bigwigs and promoted via Fox News, so even if the folk that were actually out there protesting had legit gripes, they'll be drowned out by the focus that the corporate organizers want to be publicized. If you are out there with a legit gripe (and I know many of the non-crazies are) then you should be aware you're hitching your wagon to a company mule, who'll drive you where the company wants you to go.
Your protest sounds a lot different from the one down here. Down here it was all about bitter, crazy people pissed off that their people weren't in power anymore. They weren't mad about paying taxes--they're paying less of them starting with the rollout from April 1, IIRC--and when the local news reporter tried to ask 'em what they were mad about, she had to run away before they attacked her.
Which is the underlying problem with the teabag protest--the people taking to the streets aren't pushing the same message the people on the news are. Grassroots movement has to start from the bottom and then go up, not the other way around. Then by the time it attracts media attention, there's a clear message to be pulled out of the actual behaviors and actions of the movement, independent of the leech collections who glom onto any such movement in the hopes of piggybacking their messages onto the main one. This was a top-down thing, and it's not strong enough or old enough to support the leeches who are diluting and diverting a message that's unclear to begin with.
Me, I'd rather dump a trillion bucks into the economy than into a sand pit in the middle east where half of it will be looted before it even hits the ground. Preferably funneling the money into the industry that makes wooden spoons and pizza paddles, then lining up the banksters for one huge spanking machine.
If you really want to make a difference and/or register your displeasure, pull your assets from the bad banks and put it into your local or regional banks and credit unions. Local banks and credit unions have historically been--and continued to be--much more conservative with their risks (ie safer!). Plus, it stimulates the economy locally--the more money local banks have, the more they can afford to lend to small businesses, the more local small businesses that can stay afloat, the more employed people there are, the more local goods are in the region, the cheaper the local goods are, the happier your friends and neighbors will be, et cetera et cetera.
PS - if you haven't already found this, the Bonddad blog (http://bonddad.blogspot.com/) is a really touchable source for a lot of financial explanation in plain speech. And he does really cool graphs too. He's got graphs and analysis for *everything* though, so if you're at all into it, you'll get sucked in.
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Honestly, I don't believe this, or rather I don't think they're any more astroturfed than any typical liberal rally, protest or movement. I watched this thing pretty much spontaneously ignite over the internet. There were three or four spending protests that pretty much almost everyone ignored until Rick Santelli went bonkers on CNBC. It picked up steam from there, and there were dozens and dozens of protest rallies that no one, not even Fox News was covering, that led up to this. Fox News didn't even jump on the bandwagon until about a week ago - and I know this because my dad, who watches that stupid channel religiously suddenly started mentioning it. They came to the party, way, way late - which is why I hate them, because it makes it look like they're the one's pushing this whole thing.
Which is the underlying problem with the teabag protest--the people taking to the streets aren't pushing the same message the people on the news are.
Agreed. There was a lot more going on at those rallies than what the news was pushing. A lot of stuff was state specific, at least at the rally in Lansing, and from what I hear about the one in Sacramento as well.
I think the unclearness of the message is evidence that this wasn't astroturfed. If it were, there'd be a lot more coherency. As it was, it was pretty obvious, at least to me, that this was thrown together by people who were inexperienced at this kind of thing. You could tell by how unorganized everything was. Hell, I didn't even know that there were three other tea parties in the county I live in because they sprang up so quickly.
Me, I'd rather dump a trillion bucks into the economy than into a sand pit in the middle east where half of it will be looted before it even hits the ground. Preferably funneling the money into the industry that makes wooden spoons and pizza paddles, then lining up the banksters for one huge spanking machine.
I personally think both of those are terrible options. Taking money away from people who've been successful enough to make and invest it well and give it to the government - who by it's very nature is wasteful - is madness to me. It's just taking good money and tossing it after bad.
For example, 550 million dollars is being given to the Detroit Public Schools with no oversight. They are giving half a billion dollars to people who had to have their airport and their zoo taken away from them by the State of Michigan because they cannot manage to run them due to the bureaucracy and sheer corruption. The school system is so bad there that only 32% of the kids manage to graduate.
Money is not the problem here. Michigan teachers are some of the highest paid in the nation. The Detroit Public Schools spends $11,000 a year per student - and that's more than most of the other districts in the state. The problem is the teacher's union, the sheer corruption of the city, and the fact that even though the city residents are crying out for more charter schools, the state legislature won't raise the cap and allow more. The fix is in changing the policies, not tossing more money at this problem.
If I thought that the Detroit Public Schools would be turned around by dumping money on them, I'd say go for it, but really, it would be a hell of a lot more productive to pile all of that money up and set it on fire. Seriously. This is only going to make a fucked up situation much, much worse because this money is going to end up going directly to the corrupt bureaucrats that keep running that city into the ground. Those kids aren't going to benefit from one dime.
And this is just one example of wasteful spending. So I think the protesters have a very legitimate point to make.
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The other alternative, deflation, is much, much uglier.
I think, anyways.
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The people I feel bad for are the savers, because with all of this cheap money from the fed floating around and interest rates so low, the people with bank bonds (like my grandmother) are getting completely hosed with these insanely low interest rates. And, of course, the money itself is worth less with more of it being printed. It seems like we're stealing money from those people with our monetary policy, so we can bail out people/companies/banks that made some really bad decisions.
I dunno. I'm really not smart enough to understand how all of this works. I guess I'm just worried that by trying to fix the problem, we're going to end up making things worse. That maybe if we let the credit market go through it's cycle and unwind all of this bad debt, that the market will recover on it's own. But maybe that's just wishful thinking on my part.
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There's no way Social Security and Medicare will be able to keep up when that alone hits.
We are well and truly screwed.
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That's why I get annoyed with the people who act like the protesters are idiots and say things like "Obama just cut taxes for everyone with his tax credit, morons!" Sure taxes aren't bad now, but there's no way that only a very small percentage of rich people (the $250,000 + crowd) are going to be able to pay off all of this debt we're running up. Taxes are going to eventually have to go up for everyone to pay for all of this stuff.
I want people to be taken care of, I really do, but I really don't understand how the hell we're going to pay for all of this stuff without crippling the economy or putting a huge debt burden on our kids.
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What I am afraid of, is that in order to control the outrageous cost of providing universal health care, the government is going to have to ration health care. (http://www.slate.com/blogs/blogs/kausfiles/archive/2009/04/17/new-dem-health-care-pitch-we-ll-deny-treatments.aspx) The only thing that I can imagine worse than an HMO bureaucrat making these calls, is a government bureaucrat making them.
Governments by their vary nature are bloated and wasteful - which is why I think that the less involved they are in stuff, the better it is for everyone involved. Plus, I really don't understand how the hell we're going to pay for this, on top of two other entitlement programs that are about to fiscally implode (just wait until the baby boomers start drawing social security), all of the bailouts, the war spending and the stimulus spending. It just blows my mind that right now, with all this debt, people think it would be a good time to create a third entitlement program.
Finally, while I agree that health insurance shouldn't be a privilege, I also think that providing insurance is not the government's job or role. The government is there to do stuff like provide for the national defense, make roads, have courts systems, etc... I'd rather see reforms in other areas like education, which would help people get jobs so they could afford to buy their own insurance.
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As for rationing, look at the other examples. Even countries that have healthcare rationing have a better standard of care than we do.
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I've seen lots of conflicting evidence about this, studies that have talked about quality of care, long wait times for even simple treatments, etc, and honestly I'm not sure what to believe. I think that sometimes Democrats romanticize the European, Japanese, and Canadian health care systems while the Republicans overly demonize them.
I was reading an article in the Economist about Japan's universal health care system, and while Japan thought it was fantastic, 50% of their hospitals are on the verge of bankruptcy. I also worry that places like the Mayo Clinic will become inaccessible to average middle class Americans because some government bureaucrat decides that it's not worth the cost. And every single doctor, nurse and health care provider I've ever talked to, regardless of their own personal political beliefs, thinks that universal, government provided health care is a bad, bad idea. I can't tell if they're just looking out for their own best financial interests or if they know something the rest of us don't.
So I guess I don't know. I find the health care problem in this country totally confusing, and I can't really claim to understand how it works or what should be done. However, I have seen how the government wastes money elsewhere. I also know that if we do create an entitlement of state sponsored, universal health care and it turns out to be worse than what we have now, there's absolutely zero chance of it ever getting dismantled.
I'm extremely wary of creating another government entitlement program while the two we already have haven't been fixed and are hurdling towards financial implosion. Maybe if the government could get their shit together when it comes to Social Security, and prove that it can actually handle our tax dollars effectively, I'd be more inclined to give it a chance.
At any rate, the people in power disagree with me, so really, what I think is pretty irrelevant. I expect that within the next year or so, we're going to have a universal health care entitlement whether we like it or not.