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This rant has been brewing in the back of my mind for awhile. I suppose it applies to both Revan and the Exile, actually, although I really haven't read that many kotor 2 fics.
This rant is bound to piss a few people off, so please, take what I say with the grain of salt. As always, this is my opinion and I can only speak for myself, and if you disagree, by all means tell me because hey, I might be wrong, and I'm always open to discussion. However, if you have a thin skin, or are offended by my reviews, turning back now might be a good plan.
The kotor fandom has, at its heart, a special problem built directly into the canon of the story, mainly that there are two Sues (Revan and the Exile) that are right into the center of the plot. Unlike other fandoms, where people make up OC Sues and somehow force them into the plot, they don't have to do that in kotor stories, because they already have Revan or the Exile who, except for a very few things, can be entirely the creation of the writer.
This, I suspect, is a product of good game design. I mean, who wants to play a game where your character isn't important or the center of everything (okay, me... but that's another subject entirely)? But what made a fantastic gaming experience doesn’t necessarily make good fodder for a story, and I think that's one of the reasons why a lot of versions of the Exile and Revan fall so amazingly flat.
Finding a decent version of Revan is rare. A lot of the times what happens is that I like what the author has done with the rest of the characters, but their version of Revan is a sue, or is just flat out bland. So I've compiled a list (because lists are fun) of the common Revan problems that I see in fics, and some ways that an author can work around it and come up with something a bit more balanced and interesting.
1. Perfect Revan
I have read a lot of kotor fanfiction, and I have to say that after awhile, Revans just begin to bleed together into one indistinguishable bland mass of boring perfectness. It's like they come out of the same cookie cutter mold, and they've got all the flavor of wonderbread. They are feisty, determined, smart, beautiful, super kind, super forgiving, completely altruistic, rebel at authority, have a heart of gold, and always know the right thing to say. Everyone on the Ebon Hawk loves and respects and admires Revan. They all come to Revan for advice on their life, and nod and consider Revan's wise words carefully that lead to life changing decisions.
Some of this is because of what happens in the game. Everyone does come to Revan for them to solve their problems and the player as Revan ends up redeeming or obliterating (or both) an enormous number of people. But come on guys... even though that happens in the game, that doesn't mean that Revan is completely perfect. Perfect Revans are completely and utterly boring - and there are so many of them out there. Do everyone a favor and do the extra bit of work to make Revan into an actual human being.
I guess what I'm getting at here is that Revan needs a flaws to make him/her into an interesting character and so that the reader can actually sympathize with the character. And when I say flaws... I mean honest-to-god flaws that have actual consequences that have an effect (usually bad) on other people, not a good trait that is disguised as a flaw.
One of the flaws that I see authors try to give Revan is the common Sue characteristic "caring too much about people." An example of this is that Revan helps every single beggar in the game, is always putting herself in jeopardy while performing random acts of kindness for complete strangers. Everyone rolls their eyes and says something like "oh look at Revan, helping everyone all the time" while they admire her kindness even though it's inconvenient for them.
Just once, I'd like this to be blown into a real flaw that creates a huge problem, where Revan gives all of the crew's money to some random person in need and the crew is stranded for three weeks while Malak ends up conquering the galaxy because the crew couldn't get the money to refuel their ship and couldn't leave Manaan. Or maybe one of the EH crew members gets seriously injured in a fight to help rescue a beggar from some thugs and loses a limb or an eye. Or maybe Revan is a complete doormat of a person, who is incapable of saying no to anyone, and ends up getting someone killed or hurt on some trivial adventure and Carth and Bastila cuss Revan out for putting the mission in jeopardy.
I guess my point is that if you are going to give someone a flaw, follow out the logical consequences of that flaw, instead of sugarcoating it into a positive trait.
And come on guys, this is REVAN - a person who once fell to the darkside and tried to conquer the galaxy. There are all kinds of personality flaws that Revan could have: arrogance, overconfidence, lack of empathy, vanity, elitism, self centeredness, etc... Pick a few and toss them in to spice up Revan a bit and turn him/her into a real, living, breathing human being.
2. Superpowerful, Supereffective Revan
I know that canonically Revan and the Exile are super powerful and super effective, and I really don’t have a problem with Revan the asskicker in stories. However, Revan is not a god, and nobody is good at everything all the time, so it’s kind of annoying to see how many fics turn Revan into some kind of uber Jedi. I’ve seen stories where Revan is the best at everything: lightsabers, force powers, tactics, building droids, picking locks and is super charismatic and charming not to mention more intelligent than anyone else. Not only is this boring, but it’s unrealistic.
There is a very simple way around this. Pick a few things that Revan is completely bad at, and then throw her/him into a situation where s/he has to deal with it. Let other characters be better at something than Revan is. Let Mission be better at sneaking and picking locks, or let Juhani and Bastila be a better with lightsabers, or let Jolee be craftier and smarter, or Canderous be tougher. It gives them something to do, showcases their abilities and gives them a purpose in your plot.
Even better, have Revan make an error in judgment or a mistake that costs the crew dearly. Have Revan get into an argument with Bastila or Carth or Jolee or Canderous and be *gasp* wrong about something major.
3. Revan as the center of all creation.
Don’t get me wrong. Revan done well can be an extremely interesting character, but Revan is not the only character out there. While the games revolve almost entirely around Revan and the Exile, that doesn’t mean that stories should. I’ve read story after story where all the crew of the Ebon Hawk does is sit around and angst and worry about Revan’s love life.
Come on. Everything does not have to revolve around Revan. In fact, it’s far more interesting if it doesn’t.
These are grown adults. On top of that they are Jedi. Surely they would have more important things to do with their time than listen to Revan emote and wangst about his or her romantic relationships. Don’t get me wrong, I’m sure as Revan’s friends that they would worry a bit and care whether or not their friend is happy, it’s just that I’d like to see more stories where they do more than that. Where they have their own problems and worries and concerns that don’t necessarily have anything to do with what Revan is doing. Give them their own place in the plot and something to do that is only tangentially related to Revan and let their characters shine and grow and change.
4. Taking the interestingness out of Revan.
This happens a lot, where writers refuse to acknowledge that Revan was once a very bad person. They try to gloss it over by sugarcoating what Revan was doing (btw… thanks a lot Obsidian for encouraging this), or they ignore it completely.
This never fails to make my mind boggle. I mean to me, the reason Revan is so appealing and interesting is because s/he did such terrible and evil things. It’s the whole idea of atonement and redemption (for something that can never really be atoned for) that makes Revan so interesting (at least to me). So why the hell do so many stories ignore this, especially when there is such wonderful story fodder here?
It’s probably a completely personal quirk of mine, but if I read a story that ignores this, were Revan just goes on her/his merry way without even thinking about what s/he has done… I completely tune out.
Anyway, that’s my rant. I realize that with most of you I’m probably preaching to the choir, but hey, sometimes it’s just therapeutic to rant. Agree? Disagree? Any Revan pet peeves or trends in stories that drive you crazy?
This rant is bound to piss a few people off, so please, take what I say with the grain of salt. As always, this is my opinion and I can only speak for myself, and if you disagree, by all means tell me because hey, I might be wrong, and I'm always open to discussion. However, if you have a thin skin, or are offended by my reviews, turning back now might be a good plan.
The kotor fandom has, at its heart, a special problem built directly into the canon of the story, mainly that there are two Sues (Revan and the Exile) that are right into the center of the plot. Unlike other fandoms, where people make up OC Sues and somehow force them into the plot, they don't have to do that in kotor stories, because they already have Revan or the Exile who, except for a very few things, can be entirely the creation of the writer.
This, I suspect, is a product of good game design. I mean, who wants to play a game where your character isn't important or the center of everything (okay, me... but that's another subject entirely)? But what made a fantastic gaming experience doesn’t necessarily make good fodder for a story, and I think that's one of the reasons why a lot of versions of the Exile and Revan fall so amazingly flat.
Finding a decent version of Revan is rare. A lot of the times what happens is that I like what the author has done with the rest of the characters, but their version of Revan is a sue, or is just flat out bland. So I've compiled a list (because lists are fun) of the common Revan problems that I see in fics, and some ways that an author can work around it and come up with something a bit more balanced and interesting.
1. Perfect Revan
I have read a lot of kotor fanfiction, and I have to say that after awhile, Revans just begin to bleed together into one indistinguishable bland mass of boring perfectness. It's like they come out of the same cookie cutter mold, and they've got all the flavor of wonderbread. They are feisty, determined, smart, beautiful, super kind, super forgiving, completely altruistic, rebel at authority, have a heart of gold, and always know the right thing to say. Everyone on the Ebon Hawk loves and respects and admires Revan. They all come to Revan for advice on their life, and nod and consider Revan's wise words carefully that lead to life changing decisions.
Some of this is because of what happens in the game. Everyone does come to Revan for them to solve their problems and the player as Revan ends up redeeming or obliterating (or both) an enormous number of people. But come on guys... even though that happens in the game, that doesn't mean that Revan is completely perfect. Perfect Revans are completely and utterly boring - and there are so many of them out there. Do everyone a favor and do the extra bit of work to make Revan into an actual human being.
I guess what I'm getting at here is that Revan needs a flaws to make him/her into an interesting character and so that the reader can actually sympathize with the character. And when I say flaws... I mean honest-to-god flaws that have actual consequences that have an effect (usually bad) on other people, not a good trait that is disguised as a flaw.
One of the flaws that I see authors try to give Revan is the common Sue characteristic "caring too much about people." An example of this is that Revan helps every single beggar in the game, is always putting herself in jeopardy while performing random acts of kindness for complete strangers. Everyone rolls their eyes and says something like "oh look at Revan, helping everyone all the time" while they admire her kindness even though it's inconvenient for them.
Just once, I'd like this to be blown into a real flaw that creates a huge problem, where Revan gives all of the crew's money to some random person in need and the crew is stranded for three weeks while Malak ends up conquering the galaxy because the crew couldn't get the money to refuel their ship and couldn't leave Manaan. Or maybe one of the EH crew members gets seriously injured in a fight to help rescue a beggar from some thugs and loses a limb or an eye. Or maybe Revan is a complete doormat of a person, who is incapable of saying no to anyone, and ends up getting someone killed or hurt on some trivial adventure and Carth and Bastila cuss Revan out for putting the mission in jeopardy.
I guess my point is that if you are going to give someone a flaw, follow out the logical consequences of that flaw, instead of sugarcoating it into a positive trait.
And come on guys, this is REVAN - a person who once fell to the darkside and tried to conquer the galaxy. There are all kinds of personality flaws that Revan could have: arrogance, overconfidence, lack of empathy, vanity, elitism, self centeredness, etc... Pick a few and toss them in to spice up Revan a bit and turn him/her into a real, living, breathing human being.
2. Superpowerful, Supereffective Revan
I know that canonically Revan and the Exile are super powerful and super effective, and I really don’t have a problem with Revan the asskicker in stories. However, Revan is not a god, and nobody is good at everything all the time, so it’s kind of annoying to see how many fics turn Revan into some kind of uber Jedi. I’ve seen stories where Revan is the best at everything: lightsabers, force powers, tactics, building droids, picking locks and is super charismatic and charming not to mention more intelligent than anyone else. Not only is this boring, but it’s unrealistic.
There is a very simple way around this. Pick a few things that Revan is completely bad at, and then throw her/him into a situation where s/he has to deal with it. Let other characters be better at something than Revan is. Let Mission be better at sneaking and picking locks, or let Juhani and Bastila be a better with lightsabers, or let Jolee be craftier and smarter, or Canderous be tougher. It gives them something to do, showcases their abilities and gives them a purpose in your plot.
Even better, have Revan make an error in judgment or a mistake that costs the crew dearly. Have Revan get into an argument with Bastila or Carth or Jolee or Canderous and be *gasp* wrong about something major.
3. Revan as the center of all creation.
Don’t get me wrong. Revan done well can be an extremely interesting character, but Revan is not the only character out there. While the games revolve almost entirely around Revan and the Exile, that doesn’t mean that stories should. I’ve read story after story where all the crew of the Ebon Hawk does is sit around and angst and worry about Revan’s love life.
Come on. Everything does not have to revolve around Revan. In fact, it’s far more interesting if it doesn’t.
These are grown adults. On top of that they are Jedi. Surely they would have more important things to do with their time than listen to Revan emote and wangst about his or her romantic relationships. Don’t get me wrong, I’m sure as Revan’s friends that they would worry a bit and care whether or not their friend is happy, it’s just that I’d like to see more stories where they do more than that. Where they have their own problems and worries and concerns that don’t necessarily have anything to do with what Revan is doing. Give them their own place in the plot and something to do that is only tangentially related to Revan and let their characters shine and grow and change.
4. Taking the interestingness out of Revan.
This happens a lot, where writers refuse to acknowledge that Revan was once a very bad person. They try to gloss it over by sugarcoating what Revan was doing (btw… thanks a lot Obsidian for encouraging this), or they ignore it completely.
This never fails to make my mind boggle. I mean to me, the reason Revan is so appealing and interesting is because s/he did such terrible and evil things. It’s the whole idea of atonement and redemption (for something that can never really be atoned for) that makes Revan so interesting (at least to me). So why the hell do so many stories ignore this, especially when there is such wonderful story fodder here?
It’s probably a completely personal quirk of mine, but if I read a story that ignores this, were Revan just goes on her/his merry way without even thinking about what s/he has done… I completely tune out.
Anyway, that’s my rant. I realize that with most of you I’m probably preaching to the choir, but hey, sometimes it’s just therapeutic to rant. Agree? Disagree? Any Revan pet peeves or trends in stories that drive you crazy?
From:
no subject
From:
no subject
God dammit. Stop making me want to write my stupid ingame story. I refuse to re-write the first chapter so it's not going to happen. Anyway - there was this thing (since basically my ingame story was a psuedo parody) where Revan gives like all her dueling money to like Bastila's mother or something and then the ship breaks on this station - and then they have no money to fix it, so everyone is pissed at her.
Because I read a story once where Revan like added 500credits to a pile or something for Helena and I was groaning inside my head.
A lot of things bother me about Revan, one I think Revan should be a bitch - at least SOMETIMES - she was evil dammit.
Plus the whole "not fall" thing bugs the heck out of me, she fell - don't take that away from the first game it's one of the things that makes her so interesting.
Or the worse, "did fall" that happens BEFORE finding Malachor/Star Forge when she was still a Jedi just to make the Exile look OMG SUPER SWEET!
Also, I know everyone goes "I can write Revan however I want," but really you can't. There were some things in the game that defined her personality, you can gather that from what the other people told you and from some of the dialog choices.
Perfect lightside goodgirls would not get Carth - ever.
Hearts and sunshine! BEAUTY IS ME! *rants*
You KNOW this bothers me, or else I wouldn't have written the... story.
I also hate wangsty Revan cos she's Revan - she's Revan, she's tactical, she'll get over it. And I've only seen that personality overlay thing (which I really hate as an excuse) done well a few times. Usually it's just another way to completely replace anything about Revan with a new personality.
I have more, but I can't really think of it right now.
From:
no subject
Also, I know everyone goes "I can write Revan however I want," but really you can't. There were some things in the game that defined her personality, you can gather that from what the other people told you and from some of the dialog choices.
I agree with this. I mean, there's a lot of room for embellishment when it comes to Revan's personality, definitely enough for each author to put their own stamp on Revan, but there are certain characteristics that are established in the game that Revan ought to have.
In addition, unless the author is going with the total personality replacement approach, there are certain character traits that Revan ought to have, because people who are effective military leaders would have those particular character traits. So when I see super fluffy and sweet Revan's I tend to roll my eyes and think: "Yeah, right. Like, this woman would have had the brains and the choobies to try and conquer the galaxy. Please."
Perfect lightside goodgirls would not get Carth - ever.
Agreed. I've read so many stories were super perfect and insanely nice Revans end up with Carth... and it makes me rather nauseous, really. I keep thinking that if Carth were ever actually in a situation with these women, he would find them just as amazingly boring as I do.
And I've only seen that personality overlay thing (which I really hate as an excuse) done well a few times. Usually it's just another way to completely replace anything about Revan with a new personality.
My big problem with most of the stories that do the whole Revan has a new personality thing, is that most of the new personalities don't make a hell of a lot of sense. You think if the council could implant a new person in her mind, they'd make the former Dark Lord a meek librarian that faints at the sight of blood, as opposed to the super feisty asskicking ninja smuggler Revan who has a problem with authority.
From:
no subject
One thing I hope I never see in KotOR fics is "Player Controlled Revan" as I think of it. Kinda like Perfect!Revan, PC!Revan automatically knows the answer to the most difficult puzzle or problem within thirty seconds, and can solve it without having to break a sweat or break a nail. Hey, it's more interesting to see Revan fight off several of the Star Forge droids before realizing s/he can shut down the generators.
From:
no subject
And Arrow, I totally agree; Revan-with-the-blue-light-shining-out-of-her-ass would never get an IC Carth, heh.
From:
Hooray for Pris Rants!
Especially the bit about "Superpowerful, Supereffective Revan." This goes for the Exile too. Everyone seems to make their Revan/Exile this monster Force entity. "REVAN SMASH PUNY HUMANS! ARRR! REVAN STROOONNNGG!!!"
I mean, crimminy.
I like Goro's Revan... a drunkard, a smoker, who wastes money on gambling and pimps out the female members of the crew and runs away to Brazil.
MY Revan will have flaws, just you wait, he won't floss after meals! *gasp*
From:
Re: Hooray for Pris Rants!
From:
Re: Hooray for Pris Rants!
MY Revan will have flaws, just you wait, he won't floss after meals! *gasp*
Okay... now you have to write it, because that's hilarious.
From:
no subject
Well said, and straight to the core of the matter, as usual. You're spot on about characters needing doubts and flaws, nothing is worse than Picture Perfect stories, blech.
From:
no subject
So, thought I'd add to the list:
Revan the virgin, which was covered in an earlier rant of yours, especially virgin!Revan who is healed/sexed up through hawt Carth twu wuv sex.
Teen!Revan, who apparently whipped the Mandalorians' asses while still in diapers.
Revan who completely denies she was Revan (really just an OC with the name of Revan, and gets Carth/Bastila), which might be covered in one of your above points.
From:
no subject
Ooh yes, that's a good one. That just bugs the hell out of me. Like the Republic fleet is going to let a 16 year old kid take the helm. Even in Star Wars, where people seem to be thrust into positions of power at a young age, that's a bit difficult to swallow.
From:
no subject
Which means I agree with everythings, pretty much.
From:
no subject
Anyway, just wanted to say I feel exactly the same way..
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Surfing along the blog highway
I did think that when Revan was captured, that if they would recreate a new personality, why not make it selfless, loyal, and obedient? I wouldn't want to take any chances in that regard if I were the Jedi. I thought it might be interesting if the PC were somewhat perfect and have it all unravel by the end. Different approach. Anyhow, that's my two cents...surf's up.
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Re: Surfing along the blog highway
You know, that's one of the things that I liked about kotor2. While the Exile was still the center of the game, being able to play segments of the game as other characters (especially as Mira) was a hell of a lot of fun, and it was interesting to see those characters get more of the spotlight.
And really the in game version of Revan is more of an idea than a character, which is why it's easier to get attached to Carth & Bastila than Revan.
I did think that when Revan was captured, that if they would recreate a new personality, why not make it selfless, loyal, and obedient? I wouldn't want to take any chances in that regard if I were the Jedi. I thought it might be interesting if the PC were somewhat perfect and have it all unravel by the end.
I completely agree with this, and it's my biggest problem with the Revan has a new personalities in most stories. Seriously, Revan wouldn't be the defiant super ninja feisty smuggler, because it would make no sense for the Council to give her that personality. And having it all unravel makes for a very interesting approach.
From:
no subject
(cries)
Did Goro really write a fict with Mafia!Revan? Wow the things I miss. Okay I want to see this.
From:
no subject
From:
no subject
The next chapter is my Revan chapter and I was struggling to make him interesting. Thank you so much for posting this rant.